FCF: I am sitting here with Frank Shamrock after a great seminar that he put on before the Shogun event takes place. I believe the last fight you had was a kickboxing match under K-1 type rules wasn't it?
Frank Shamrock: Yeah, I fought in the K-1 event on August 11th at the Bellagio hotel [in Las Vegas, NV]. That was my last fight. Kickboxing is different. It is a lot more specialized. I enjoyed the challenge, even though it didn't last that long.

FCF: There are kickboxers who enter submission grappling tournaments to get better at grappling. Did you fight in a kickboxing match to improve your stand up or just to see where you are at?
FS: I did it to see where my striking level was at, but I have fought for a long time and fought against some really tough people. I don't really care about fighting too many more people. I needed something to challenge me and that was a good challenge. I like to challenge myself.

FCF: Other than that, what else were you up too?
FS: Nothing. I was supposed to fight on November 3rd at Pride, but I hurt my rib, so I didn't fight. So I am just training. I am training some of the K-1 kickboxers to fight no rules. I will probably start training Jerome Le Banner for no rules fighting. I have just been helping Bob [Crazy Bob Cook] and the team a little bit.

FCF: Who were you scheduled to fight in November?
FS: It was coming down to fight that Ninja guy [Murillo Ninja] or [Daijiro] Matsui. But you know what? Three weeks ago I did not have an opponent and then I got hurt. I just said screw it.

FCF: Is Pride trying to work into a three-way fight between you, Vanderlei [Silva] and [Kazushi] Sakuraba?
FS: I think what they are doing is setting up a middleweight tournament and take the winners of the tournament and create a stronger middleweight class.

FCF: I heard that Pride is going to set up a Pride Middleweight Grand Prix.
FS: Yeah, they going with middleweights in kickboxing and now they want middleweights for Pride too. I think that this class is receiving a lot more recognition because before I just fought whoever. I fought [Tsuyoshi] Kosaka [in RINGS]. I fought all those guys at whatever weight they weighed. Then I fought [Kiyoshi] Tamura. I fought Tito [Ortiz]. I fought Enson [Inoue]. None of those guys are 185lbs.

FCF: Is that the weight class that you are going to compete at, if everyone adheres to the new weight classes?
FS: Yeah. I will fight at 185lbs. The reason is that I weigh 192lbs, so I just won't eat breakfast and eat a light dinner and be there.

FCF: What has been keeping you out of the fight game? Have you just gotten bored of fighting?
FS: I got nothing going on. The UFC wants me to sign a long term fighting contract. I don't care about these things. I have already done that. I have fought in every major show there is. I fought in every single major style [of rules] and even professional kickboxing. Now what else do I do? It's fun and interesting, but it gets old. Who am I going to fight? Dave Menne? I think that Dave is super tough, but he isn't going to stand a chance with me. So what do I do?

FCF: Where do you go from here?
FS: I am going to train starting January 1st and start fighting in February or March.

FCF: I guess the only major title that you have not gotten is the recently created Pride Middleweight Championship. Do you have your sights set on that?
FS: Yeah, but for me it's not about titles and opponents. I have tons of titles and I've fought tons of guys. For me it is that some guys are tough and some guys are exciting and there are some guys who I think that might be able to beat me. That's who I want to fight. I don't care. Menne is a great guy, a super tough guy, but he's not going to beat me, so to me, why would I fight him? It gives him a chance to see how tough he is and I know how tough I am, so…I was really excited about fighting Sakuraba, but that got pushed on the back burner. I am just a kid that has fun with his toys.

FCF: At such a high level at such a young age, if you are already getting bored, where do you go from here?
FS: This is definitely the ultimate sport. It can't get any more down to earth than this. I'll probably try professional boxing because I always wanted to try that. Then I'll do a couple more fights, but I will do fights at my shows. I don't want to make someone else money. Why should I? I've made them plenty already. [laughs] I just want to fight and enjoy myself and teach and hang out with my friends and enjoy the interaction with people. I will be back fighting in February or March.

FCF: Who are the guys that you would like to fight?
FS: I haven't fought [Kazushi] Sakuraba. I really like him. I really like Vanderlei Silva, he's really cool. He's exciting. I haven't fought any of the Gracie guys. I would like to fight one of them, just for fun, you know? That's really about it. There are so many guys out there and I don't really follow what is going on out there because there is so much going on. I like the martial arts part of it.

FCF: Your school is based out of Javier Mendez's American Kickboxing Academy isn't it? Tell us about your school.
FS: American Kickboxing Academy is in San Jose [California] and it is owned by Javier Mendez. We have been training there since '97. Javier started training me for Enson [Inoue] and subsequently I opened a school inside there and we started submission training, me and Bob Cook. We do all the submission wrestling and submission fighting and then at our school we have a professional fight team. We've got a ton of fighters down there and have a really open environment. BJ Penn trains there, Tony DeSouza, Eric Duce, Josh Thompson and Bob Cook, of course, is our lead instructor and trainer. Javier Mendez kind of watches over all of us and keeps us going.

FCF: You are known, not only for your technical skill, but also for your superb conditioning and always being ready to go as long as it takes. You have shown that you have a lot of heart, a lot of technique. However conditioning helps you keep all of those things in the fight. What are your thoughts on the aspects of conditioning? There are part-time fighters and full-time fighters, what is best for both?
FS: Well, it is just a different level when you go from amateur to professional. It is different because professionals do this all the time. That's one difference. It's like taking your corvette out for the weekend and driving some laps and then racing your car all day long. Conditioning is your best submission hold and cardiovascular training is best. As long as you have good cardiovascular strength and can breathe, but at the same time be moving, you can be safe. For the novice guy, I recommend hard core cardiovascular training.

FCF: Some people say that the best cardiovascular training is actually doing what you are going to be doing. If you are grappling then sparring is the best way to build cardiovascular endurance for instance. Other people say that you have to do road work and fundamental cardio training. What is your opinion?
FS: My opinion is that cardiovascular training is cardiovascular training. You should only work your heart, your lungs and your circulatory [system]. If you are working other muscles while you are doing that, you could be more effective. When I do cardiovascular training, I do some sort of elliptical trainer with no impact and I work my heart extremely hard. Doing techniques for cardio, I think, takes away from your technique. In order to get your heart working that hard, you've got to really be moving.

FCF: And by doing that you are sacrificing perfect technique?
FS: You are training your body incorrectly, so I would separate the two. If you are a novice guy, it takes nothing to go in there and do 30 minutes of cardio. As opposed to lifting weights and doing anything else. The 30 minutes of cardio will enhance your life, shake away all your disease and give you the energy to go do things, like wrestle or screw around.

FCF: When you say work your heart, most people say that 60-65% of your max heart rate is for fat burning and around 80-85% is for endurance. What percentage are you striving for?
FS: I always maintain 70% and I go up from there. The last two or three weeks until my fight, I am trying to work up to 80% and above.

FCF: How long are you staying above 80%?
FS: For 20-25 minutes.

FCF: Does the duration change with the duration of the fight? Like 5 rounds of 5 minutes each adding up to 25 minutes?
FS: The only thing that I do differently is if I have timed rounds. At the end of the round, I sprint. If I am doing 20 minutes of cardio and I have four 5-minute rounds, then at the end of every fourth minute, I sprint to simulate what I'm doing in the ring. I want my cardio to simulate the speed and intensity I have in the ring.

FCF: Do you find that working your cardio in this isolated way helps in all aspects, like grappling, take downs and striking?
FS: It doesn't matter. It really doesn't. The types of cardio may matter. If you are running a lot then you have a lot of impact on your knees, your shins and lower back. If you are swimming a lot than you have a lot of strain on your shoulders. That is why I recommend that if you can get zero impact or close to it, that is the absolute best. That way you don't do any damage to your body while you are working your hearts and your lungs. I separate cardio from everything. When I tell people that I am going to do cardio, I am ONLY going to do cardio and nothing else.

FCF: Do you run any stairs or hills?
FS: I do sprints. And I do deep knee bends and squats, duck walks and lunges and conditioning exercises.

FCF: What would you call the body weight exercise that you do like deep knee bends, push ups, etc.?
FS: I would call those muscular conditioning because you are conditioning your muscles.

FCF: Do you treat that in a similar way as cardio, where you are looking for a certain heart rate?
FS: No, on that I go for repetitions and technique. Like if I am doing body lifts, lifting someone's body, I really strive for good technique and doing as many repetitions as I can. When you are fighting, you are lifting your body hundreds of times in different positions and sometimes the other guy's body. So if you can just move your bodyweight very efficiently and have good cardiovascular training, you will be a force to be reckoned with because it would be hard to stop you. And that is kind of my theory. I am in really good shape and I move really move fast and I pull techniques like crazy and one of them usually lands and that is usually how the fight goes.

FCF: In your new videotape series do you cover this?
FS: I have four tapes out. One is a seminar of a sports specific training seminar. It has plyometrics training and basic grappling stuff and then I also have three other video tapes out that cover muscular conditioning, mat conditioning for sport specific exercises, submissions and their escapes and then take downs and their escapes. So I have the three tape series that covers a very basic system, but a very nice system. A very clean and technical system. Everything that we do is 100% technique, we really focus on the technique and the alignment of the body and the natural mechanics and those angles that can be created with your body.

FCF: On top of muscular conditioning, cardiovascular training, technical training and sparring, is there any other aspect that we are missing?
FS: I would say mental training. And by mental training, I mean visualization and also what I call practical application. What I mean by that is, if I say, "Hey, grab my arm, I want to see what I do in this situation," because then you know what you are going to do automatically in this situation. And then you can see what you are going to do and either stop yourself or do something different. We do a lot of what I call, situation drills. "Hey what would you do if I did this? Oh, I would do this. Oh, well, I would do this." And it builds from there and your brain works, so that you are not just scrambling around.

FCF: Other than situational drills, what specifically are you visualizing? Some people visualize their hand getting raised or the belt being put around their waist. Others try visualize the first 30 seconds of their match and then go on auto-pilot. What do you do?
FS: Visual training is just like regular training. By the time that you walk into the ring, the fight has already been decided. Mentally, you should have decided it already and be in the winner's circle. Before that training, you are training your brain to do these techniques. So if I learn a technique, I am going to drill and drill and drill and then I am going to sit down and go over it in my brain. I am going to go, "elbow in, hips here, etc." and then the next day we are going to drill it and talk about it and we are going to try some situations with it and I am going to drill it into my brain. So when I am stretching, I can be thinking about that technique the whole time, so when I go to apply it, my body already knows what is supposed to be going on. My brain has already done it one hundred times. So now it is just a reaction. I find that it drops into my sub-conscious a lot easier because I trained my brain. Now when all the training is done and I look at the fight, I can start thinking, "I have all these tools, now I have to figure out how I am going to use these to win." Some people just skip all that stuff and visualize their hand being raised, but you can't trick your brain. Your brain knows that what it did and didn't do and that is why you can work your way up to visualizing victory. That way it is truly embedded.

FCF: Along with your technical training, do you split up the different aspects within that, like striking, take downs and grappling or do you break it down into boxing, kickboxing, clinches, take downs and grappling?
FS: Everything is different according to the people that you have available. I box with pro boxers. I kickbox with pro kickboxers. I do no rules with the no rules guys. We'll do take downs and kickboxing. We'll do boxing and take downs. We do boxing and wrestling. We do wrestling and kicking. We just keep mixing it up. That way you always experience something and when you are in the ring and something happens, you are like, "Oh, this is just like what Jose did to me when we doing this, that and the other." So we just try to experience as many things as possible.

FCF: Do you allocate a specific amount of time for each? Like, I want to work a couple hours on this and then I want to work a couple hours on that.
FS: Not really. We have a sort of schedule, like Mondays and Wednesdays, we do sparring with take downs, a sort of schedule, but when you get in there and there is 15-20 guys, I'll say, "let's work on this." Our gym is really open-minded. If someone comes up with a technique, they share it. Like if Bob comes up with a good technique, we are all going to go over to Bob and say, "Bob, what is that new technique?" And Bob is going to share it with us. And if Bob has a question or builds something that seems to work, he is going to bring it to us and say, "Look at this." And we will all kind of examine it and try it and see who it works for and who it doesn't. If it works, we keep it and if it doesn't we throw it out. If it works then we start drilling it, visualizing it and adding it to our game. The great thing is that we have 20 guys all bringing in information and we have 20 guys assessing it and finding the answers.

FCF: Thanks for the great seminar and your time.
FS: No problem.