If you have never heard of him you better ask somebody! For those in the Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu community, Saulo Ribeiro is a household name. The 3-time World Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Champion in 3 different weight classes [black belt divisions: 73kg, 79kg, 91kg], is just 24 years old. NHB fans may have heard of him from his second-place finish at the 1999 Abu Dhabi World Submission Wrestling Championships [88-98kg class]. We asked Saulo about his up and coming BJJ matches, thoughts on the top NHB fighters, his aspirations of NHB, and more. I caught up with Saulo at the Relson Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Academy, Honolulu, Hawaii on May 19, 1999.

FCF: Tell me about your martial arts background. How long have you been training?
Saulo Ribeiro: I started in Judo, when I was 14 years old. Then, at 16, I pass for Jiu-Jitsu. I have been training in Jiu-Jitsu since 1990, almost 10 years. I am black belt Judo and black belt Jiu-Jitsu, and black belt Karate. Since then, I practice Jiu-Jitsu and Judo. My specialty is the Jiu-Jitsu for sure.

FCF: What style of Karate?
SR: Kyokushinkai

FCF: Where do you train and where are your academies?
SR: I train in Rio de Janeiro, with Royler Gracie at his academy Gracie Humaita. I have my own school in Tijuca, it is a branch from Gracie Humaita

FCF: A lot of people outside the BJJ community has never heard of you. Can you tell us about your accomplishments and don't be modest?
SR: Some people don't know about me because they concerned about no-holds barred. The guys [who] do vale tudo and UFC and Pride. These guys, for sure, you heard about the guys. Most of these guys who fought in no-holds barred, I beat them in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu tournaments like Fabio Gurgel, Murilo Bustamante, Carlao Barreto, plenty guys. So, my titles are, I'm 3 times World Champion, 5 time Brazilian [National] Champion. I'm 3 times [Rio de Janeiro] State Champion, my division and the open division. I'm Brazilian Champion in Judo in 1996. I have two vale tudos in Brazil, I won both, and that's it.

FCF: What year was the vale tudos?
SR: It was in Rio de Janeiro, in Hebraica, in 1996, both. Against Kung-Fu and Karate (practioners).

FCF: At Abu Dhabi, you entered the next weight class above, why?
SR: Yeah, I competed in the class, 100 kg because the class below Renzo [Gracie] would fight and Royler ask me to fight in the other category because he don't want me to match against Renzo.

FCF: Were you hoping to face any particular competitor?
SR: No, I was ready to fight against anyone. I don't care.

FCF: How was the "Abu Dhabi" experience?
SR: Yeah, it was nice because now I know that I cannot give to many weight to the guys. I can't give this chance. The guy I fought in the finals, Jeff Monsen, he's a wrestler guy, a champion wrestler. He has 14 kilos [30.8lbs] more than me. So it's definitely hard to fight another guy heavier than you. And the rules at the Abu Dhabi [Championships] was not too good because the guy can escape from the match and nothing happen, no penalties. And I took his arm a couple times and he run off the mats, but it was OK. I like a lot.

FCF: What are your training methods, including how long you take to prepare yourself for major tournaments like the Mundial [World BJJ Championships]? Please give us a lot of details.
SR: I keep my body warm teaching Jiu-Jitsu everyday. But I separate 4 weeks for my prepare for the Worlds [Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Championships]. In the morning, I lift weights, then I rest a little bit. I train only in the techniques in the afternoon. And in the evening, Jiu-Jitsu three times a week, two times a week [I train in] Judo. And Tuesday and Thursday I run and swim. Basically that's it. My food I change totally because I eat a lot of carbohydrates and meat. Basically that's it.

FCF: Do you change your training methods when preparing for a submission tournament where the gimono is optional? If so, how?
SR:Basically it's the same. I'm always ready to catch what the guy give to me. I don't think about the points. I don't think about the submission. I just prepare myself to wait for the best chance to make the points or to submit the guy. Basically, with gi or without gi, it's the same. I have to use my pure Jiu-Jitsu.

FCF: Please tell all the BJJ guys your philosophy on training? Are you more of a strategist that plans out your attack or a person who is constantly looks for submissions?
SR: Personally, my Jiu-Jitsu is for submit. But in Brazilian tournaments with 10 minutes, it's hard sometimes to submit the guy. I prepare a lot, like you [the other person] and in 10 minutes, you can't open all the space you need to submit the guy because sometimes you have to involve the guy. And in 10 minutes, you can do a lot of things. Sometimes it's better you do some points than open some space and the guy make advantage or points, so it depends on the opportunity that the guy give to me. But if I have a chance, for sure I'm going to try and beat the guy.

FCF: When BJJ first burst on the scene it was common knowledge that two BJJ fighters would not fight against each other in NHB matches, but now it seems anything goes. You definitely respect the "old ways" by moving up in weight at Abu Dhabi. How do you feel about BJJ practitioners fighting each other?
SR: The guys from the same martial arts, like Jiu-Jitsu, I don't agree they should fight each other because they have a lot of guys from different martial arts to prove [themselves]. So, if we train Jiu-Jitsu we have a lot of guys to fight against; Judo, Karate, grappling, Wrestlers, we don't need to fight each other, Jiu-Jitsu against Jiu-Jitsu, because it's not comfortable for the guys to fight from the same martial art. But, of course we are professionals, if we have opportunity to fight for a good [amount of] money, of course the guys gonna fight, for sure.

FCF: The growth of BJJ in America has caused a lot of students and instructors to change academies or switch instructors. I understand this is not necessarily a normal practice in Brazil, but what are your feelings on this subject?
SR: I believe your Jiu-Jitsu is going to grow in the academy that you started at because the teacher that started to teach you knows exactly what you need to be a champion, to be an instructor, to be a teacher. When you change from academy, you break these lines because the other teacher maybe don't know the philosophy or the experience that you have, that pass to you. So, it's hard. In Brazil, we do that because when you born in academy, it's very hard you change your academy. But, of course, sometimes something happen and you don't feel comfortable in the academy. We have to study case to case because sometimes it's necessary to change academies. But in my academy, I talk with my students. I know exactly what they need. And if somebody is not happy with the class, with everything, I talk with him, I explain, and I listen to him. I try to change something. I think that to change the academy is the last chance [resort] to do it.

FCF: Tell us about your up and coming matches?
SR: I have a fight now on 23, June in Brazil, a special match. I have the State [Rio de Janeiro Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Championships] in June too. I have the World [Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu] Championships in July. Maybe I want to fight in Pride or in UFC or why not Super Brawl. I'm waiting for the best opportunity for me. The Brazilian [National] Championships are going to be in October and maybe a special fight in December. That's it.

FCF: The match in June is that against Mario Sperry?
SR: Yeah, Mario Sperry.

FCF: How much does he outweigh you by?
SR: He has 220lbs, 100 kilos. My weight is 189lbs, 85 kilos.

FCF: What is your opinion of Mario Sperry?
SR: He's one of the most difficult competitors to be beat now. Because he's strong, he competes good, and he has a good strategy. But when you don't have a time limit, I don't know if he's ready for this kind of fight. Because in 10 minutes, for sure he is a lion, but I want to know if 40 minutes, 1 hour, 2 hours, he's going to continue to be a lion. That's what I'm waiting for. I know that I'm going to be ready, 1 hour, 2 hours, I can pass all day. I don't know if he's ready for this.

FCF: And that match is going to be no time limit, no points and submission only?
SR: No points, no time limit, yes.

FCF: What do you feel are the keys to your success or what are his weaknesses?
SR: The most important thing is you be a accessible [self-assured] guy to ask about the position. Sometimes a student of mine has a good position, I feel comfortable to go to the guy and ask 'Hey man, how do you do that, how do you do this?' I don't care if I'm the teacher, I will not ask anybody because I know everything. This is not true. No body knows everything. Everyday you learn something different. And I'm open. I open my mind to receive all the new things. So, everyday I learn more with my students, with my parents, with everybody. And I know that what happen to me now, one day is going to pass. And I try to keep all my friends close to me because Jiu-Jitsu is like a family. If you have a background with good persons, for sure your going to have success because Jiu-Jitsu is not only you. It's your friends, your family, your partners in training. They going to push you up to the things going good. I have good friends. I have good partners of training. I have good guys who support me. When I win, everybody win, when I lose, everybody lose. It's because it's not only Saulo, it's a lot of background, it's a lot of guys that help me to be a champion.

I don't know if his [Mario Sperry] heart is bigger than mine. I don't believe this. I believe that my heart is going to eat his heart. He can be strong, he can be good, but I don't know if his heart is bigger than mine. I believe that I can beat him because I won a lot and I don't think that he is ready for this.

FCF: You seem to thrive and get excited about tough matches. How did you develop this attitude?
SR: Since I was a kid, I would prove myself against big guys, against anyone. I always wanted to be the number one. I like this. I be comfortable with the pressure. I don't have an problem with the pressures. I like, because I can support that. And when I have a difficult match, it's the time that I like because if I win, I'm going to prove myself that I can do it. If it doesn't happen, I'm going to learn some thing and I'm going to prepare myself to win again. So, in the victory, in the loss, I'm always going to win because something's going to change, something's going to happen. And if I win, I want to be looking for another challenge because a fighter has to prove everyday what he expects from Jiu-Jitsu.

FCF: Are you in Hawaii just to train Marcello Tigre (for his match against Egan Inoue at Super Brawl) or for some other reason?
SR: Basically, I'm here to visit my friend Relson, to support, to see the guys at the academy, teach a little bit, and to give help Marcello. He's a friend of mine from Brazil. But he doesn't represent the Gracie Jiu-Jitsu, he's [from] another school in Brazil. And he has an opportunity to fight here at Super Brawl. And we are here to help him too. I'm here to see the fighters in Super Brawl because I want to fight here one day, maybe here, maybe UFC. Let's see if the guy give me a good [amount of] money for fight here. I would like to fight here against anyone. I don't care.

FCF: I, along with the whole academy, would love it if you moved here and became a permanent instructor here (at the Relson Gracie Jiu-Jitsu Academy). Do you have any plans to move to Hawaii?
SR: Basically, I'm very involved with the fighters in Brazil. I have more, maybe 5 or 6 years of competition in Brazil. I have my sponsor all the time, the ones I compete [for] in Brazil. But in the future, why not. I like Hawaii. It's a good place. It's like Brazil. The people are great. I like it a lot. Maybe it can be a [my] place, why not.

FCF: In Brazil, do you just train in Jiu-Jitsu and have no other jobs?
SR: No, I have another job. I'm a lawyer. And I graduate in '96, but basically, I have two academies in Brazil. It's hard to do both things. Today, I only teach and train for compete.

FCF: What do you think of the skill level the students here at this academy?
SR: I think that it's the best that I have saw, not only in Hawaii but in America because the guys here think about Jiu-Jitsu, the guys here are not a machine. Because what I have seen when I go to LA, California, to the states that I visit, is that the guys are like a robot because they learn a position and they don't think about that. They just do it. And here in Hawaii, I see the guys think about the moves, I think they fight with strategy. It's good and you can see this in the tournament because always the Hawaiians bring medals. I think here is one of the best places in the United States to learn Jiu-Jitsu for sure.

FCF: Everybody that knows you wants to see you in NHB. You mentioned before UFC, Pride, Super Brawl, what organization would you like to fight for and who would you like to fight?
SR: I don't have a special place. I want to know if the guys are going to pay me what I want to fight because I heard about the UFC pay you two, three thousand bucks. I prefer to compete in Jiu-Jitsu than won three thousand bucks. And the guy can say, 'but I'm going to promote you.' I'm not looking for this. I'm looking for a challenge. I'm a fighter. I'm a professional, I want to make money. So, if the guy come to me and say I have a fight for you. I fight against anyone. I don't care what weight, what style. I don't care. I fight against anyone. But I want a good [amount of] money. You give me the money, I fight against anyone. I don't care. Can be here, Super Brawl, UFC, Pride, doesn't matter. I want to see how these guys going to beat me. I think that is very hard, very difficult. And I want to prove to myself that I can do it, for sure you going to see in the next month, maybe the next year… I don't know. I don't want to hurry. I want to do the right thing. That's why [what] I'm waiting for. For Rickson, waiting for almost 5 years to fight in Japan. I'm waiting only 2 years. I'm ready. Now I'm ready. So, I can wait because the Brazilian guys are fighting only for promotion. I'm not looking for promotion. I'm looking for money and looking for the challenge. That's what happen. They want to fight but they don't prepare themselves to fight. So basically, I'm ready for that. I would like to fight against some wrestler guy, maybe Mark Kerr, maybe Randy Couture, maybe Tito Ortiz. I like this guy. I want to fight against the best. The guys that lose, I don't want to fight because they don't have nothing to prove to me. They are losers. So, I want a champion. Only champions.

FCF: You are very young and NHB is slowly turning into a young man's sport. There's a few older guys still in there, but all the up and coming fighters are younger guys. How long are you planning on competing in both BJJ and NHB?
SR: The time I want to compete is going to depend on how is your health. Because if you eat good, you sleep good, you have a healthy like, you can compete for 35, 36, 37, 38. You see Rickson, he is fighting and he has 40 years old. So, 40 [year old] ones fight now a days, [even guys] almost 50 [too]. So it depends on you. It depends on how is your lifestyle. Basically, I want to fight more 5, 6 years and that's it. Then I want to prepare my students to fight because to be a champion is good, but to make a champion is better, for sure.

FCF: A lot of Carlson Gracie's students have entered NHB. I am aware of only Royler [Gracie] and Marcello Mello, who fought in last UFC, fighting out of his academy. Are there any others at Gracie Humaita [Prof. Helio's main academy] who want to fight NHB?
SR: Yeah, I have a couple students that fought in Brazil, some small shows. And I have a team of vale tudo, but we are waiting for the good ones [shows]. We don't want to put the guys in the shitty events, only to make money. We need organized match. For sure, in the future you going to see a lot of guys from my school fighting vale tudo. I'm waiting for, I didn't find yet. So, I'm the number one on the list. After me, I'm going to put all my students to fight. Last year, I would like to bring my two students, Christiano and Gustavo, to fight in Super Brawl, but the guys didn't want to give the ticket. And it's hard, so if the guys want to see my team I can bring, no problem. But the guy have to pay for this.

FCF: What did you think of Marcello Mello's performance at the last UFC? Who do you think are the best NHB fighters and why?
SR: I like Marcello's fight. Marcello is a nice guy. He's tough. He has the experience to fight. He did a lot of vale tudo before, so he was ready to fight. I only think that in vale tudo you have to wait for your best opportunity. Marcello wants to get the guy too fast, so he make some mistake that some guys can see. I can see and for sure he's going to be better next time. About the best one, I think that the most difficult guy to beat for sure is Mark Kerr. It's hard because when you have time limit its hard to beat a big guy because you need time to make the guy make a mistake. If you give a short time, it's like in Jiu-Jitsu, it's hard to beat a big guy. I think that I can beat him, but I need time. I need one hour, two hours. I want to see if he's prepared to fight so long. If you prepare yourself to run and you know where the final line is one thing. But if the guy comes to you and say 'hey run' and you don't know when it's going to stop it's a different fight. So, I think that Pride, with rounds, 10 minutes, with 3 rounds, no one can beat Mark Kerr. He's hard man. But with no time limit, I believe in Rickson, I believe in me, I believe in Renzo. We have plenty of guys that can be him.

FCF: What do you think about Frank Shamrock and some of the other guys that are out there?
EI: Frank Shamrock is a tough guy. He's a very prepared guy. I don't see nothing special in him. I think that if he fights against a good Jiu-Jitsu fighter, he's going to tap. Because his level, I compare him like a blue belt [the second belt after white belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu] and I don't know if he's prepared to fight against a black belt in Jiu-Jitsu because he makes a lot of mistakes. He let the guy mount on him, cross him. I don't see any problem to beat him. He's a good fighter. It would be a good experience to fight against him.

FCF: Lastly, what is your future plans?
EI: I'm going to spend two more weeks here in Hawaii. I want to talk with the promoter of the event here [T. Jay Thompson, promoter of Super Brawl]. I want to know if they want me to fight here. Maybe I fight here. Back to Brazil fight the Worlds [Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Championships], going to make some seminars in Brazil and in Relson's [Gracie] associations, and waiting for the opportunity especially to fight in no-holds barred. That's what I'm looking for now.

FCF: Your not going to go back to your lawyer career?
EI: Yeah, maybe when I finish my competitive life. I do it.

FCF: Thank you for the interview and good luck with your future matches.